HGTV Stardom To Multifamily Investing, With Tarek El Moussa

Tarek El Moussa found real estate success flipping single family homes on the popular HGTV shows Flip or Flop and Flipping 101. Now he has turned his attention to multifamily investing and its potential for passive wealth growth.

Listen in as Tarek share his thoughts on the multifamily landscape, and the story behind TEM Capital, the multifamily investing company he co-founded.

Watch On YouTube

Episode Highlights

  • The story behind TEM Capital, their fund, and Tarek’s journey into multifamily.
  • What makes real estate portfolios with both single family and multifamily assets so strong.
  • An overview of TEM Capital’s diversification strategy within multifamily.
  • What notable lessons Tarek has learned from his time flipping single family homes that he’s applied to multifamily investing. 
  • What the most challenging, but ultimately successful, flip on Flip or Flop was.
  • How the current economic landscape (inflation and rising interest rates) is impacting multifamily.
  • Compelling trends in multifamily across markets.
  • Why buy and hold real estate strategies can lead to the greatest success.
  • How the design approach differs between single family to multifamily assets.
  • What kinds of investors make up the capital base of TEM Capital, and what their goals are.
  • If viewers can expect a multifamily show on HGTV from Tarek in the future.

Featured On This Episode

Today’s Guest: Tarek El Moussa

About The Multifamily Investor Podcast

The Multifamily Investor Podcast covers trends and opportunities in the multifamily real estate universe. Host Scott Hawksworth discusses passive investment offerings in the space, including direct investments, DSTs, opportunity zones, REITs, and more.

Listen Now

Show Transcript

Scott Hawksworth: Hello, and welcome to the multifamily investor podcast I’m your host Scott Hawksworth and today we’re going to be talking about well multi family but also single family.

Maybe comparing the two and looking at that and joining me to offer his insights is Tarek El Moussa who well has a lot of experience when we’re talking about single family.

He is the Co-host of Flip or Flop on HGTV as well as the host of Flipping 101 and he is also has experienced in multifamily as he is the Co founder of TEM Capital.

Which is a multi strategy commercial real estate investment firm and they have a fund focusing on multifamily so a lot to offer there Tarek welcome to the show.

Tarek El Moussa: Hey thanks for having me excited to be here.

Scott Hawksworth: Well, thank you for being here before I get into the questions.

In advance of our interview, I went to my wife, this weekend I was like hey let’s watch some flip or flop i’m gonna be talking to Tarek and she was all about it and, as we were watching it my.

Two and a half year old daughter came out and started watching and we ended the episode, and I say Okay, you know that’s enough TV for today and she goes, and she gives me the more sign she goes more.

Tarek El Moussa: You know what you know what the interesting fact about flip or flop, is when I signed the contract to do that first season, I had no money and I had no idea how to flip.

Houses So when I went to sign the contract I didn’t know how I was going to do it, so I called my attorney of the time, and I said well hey man well what’s the worst that can happen, they said, well, I mean they could Sue you and I looked around I said, they can have it.

I signed the contract and you know I made it happen, but that’s an interesting fact about flip or flop.

Scott Hawksworth: I did not know that, and I mean you think that’s fascinating That just shows you, you know hey do it, I think there’s so many opportunities out there and and folks kind of sit on the sidelines and hey take the first step and just go for it right.

Absolutely, well, I think that’s a good segue when we’re talking about multifamily and you know, as you mentioned, you know you are you’ve started Flip or Flop, and you now have co founded TEM capital, which is focused on multifamily.

what’s the story behind your fund and really your your shift to multifamily or maybe not a shift, but an ad.

Tarek El Moussa: yeah great great question so like when I first started out flipping houses that was 2010 I actually got into real estate I got into real estate at 20 years old, I started off as a real estate agent and.

You know, I was flipping houses and I started flipping more houses and then I got my TV shows, and then.

As I as my brand grew and I got more successful I had people reaching out to me every single day like you know target, we want to invest in these deals with you and I just I had no idea how to do it because.

I wasn’t sure how to bring them in to help me flip houses, because that machines running right so.

What i’ve really fallen in love with the last couple years is passive real estate investing so I used to always flip houses and think I was a real estate investor, you know.

But, for me, a real estate investor is buying real estate in a whole day so so now, the reason I flip houses, is to make active income and then, what do I do with that active income.

I buy passive income properties, so you know I just got you know, after so many people asked me to partner with me and me falling in love with passive real estate, I decided to launch this company and i’d say i’m probably more excited about this company than anything i’ve ever done.

Well, I I I just feel like you know real estate is a gift that needs to be shared with everybody It made me who I am and changed my life and.

there’s just so much opportunity out there and I just wish people understood, they can get into the game, and there are deals out there, and you can be successful in the business.

Scott Hawksworth: So it’s percent and you know kind of to that point so many of our listeners they’re focused on building wealth and.

You know they have maybe their their primary jobs where they’ve earned their income and then they want to build that wealth and protect that wealth.

And that’s where multifamily really can offer so much I kind of I guess connected to that, what do you think our overall some of the benefits of a portfolio or really a strategy in real estate investing that involves both single family and multi family.

Tarek El Moussa: You know, for me, I like diversification, you know I invest in multifamily we’re getting into a self storage deal I have almost 200 houses across the country.

I invest in stocks I invested in crypto is not the best ideas, but I did it.

The person by but you know I love all asset classes and there’s a lot of things I learned in the in the single family space that i’m taking into the apartment space and there’s a lot of stuff about the apartment space and take into the single family space.

Scott Hawksworth: yeah actually to that point what are, maybe some of the lessons you’ve learned from your time, you know flipping and working in the single family space that kind of apply to the the apartment multifamily space.

Tarek El Moussa: yeah I mean for us and apartment might be a unit.

But for somebody that’s their home right that that is where they create memories that’s where they live that’s where they raise their kids.

And, and one thing like I feel like I really bring to the table is the the design aspect but on a budget of course to the apartment space because i’ve spent so many years remodeling and making thousands of houses beautiful.

So now I just take everything I learned there and I put it into the the apartments right because we want people to feel like they’re at home.

We want them to have a gorgeous place to live, but at the same time i’ve learned over the years, how to get this these huge remodels and these beautiful designs at a really good price so it’s all about giving that high end look at a reasonable price.

Scott Hawksworth: Right and is there a bit of a difference, because obviously when you’re going single family every home is very different, whereas apartment you have a lot of the same types of units so, is it.

A matter of okay let’s walk this specific unit, we want to approach it from a design perspective, this way, and then we just we just repeat it over.

All matches.

Tarek El Moussa: And then, once you get going it’s much easier because you know you’re repeating the exact same look throughout the complex, you know so.

that’s The one thing I love about the apartments you know you design one unit, you can design 200 units to look the same.

And you know I like to do the interiors of the unit, I mean if they need it, if it’s a value add right love to do the interiors of the unit like love pick you know fixing up the exterior of the buildings.

Adding solar when we can creating dog parks throwing in some barbecues and and like I said, you know for us apartments as a business, but for tenants out there it’s their home, so I really feel like.

You know the tenants, like our buildings, because we’re really motivated to give them a nice place.

Scott Hawksworth: Absolutely, you mentioned diversification, especially when we’re talking about single versus multi family and, as I was looking through tm capital and and and how you guys.

You know present your fund and your goals part of your strategy, you mentioned is diversification within multifamily can you speak a bit to that you mentioned value add I guess what’s what’s the overall diversification strategy when you’re just focusing on multifamily.

Tarek El Moussa: You know overall we’re mostly looking for value add deals i’m a house flipper I like to make money when I buy I like to force appreciation with construction.

Right so typically we’re going after value add properties, but the same time, are we going to pass on a.

An a class or B class building that’s not value add but there’s a distressed seller know we’re going to go after that thing too So for me it’s it’s important to make money in the by and that’s honestly why I pass on so many deals.

And here’s here’s another interesting thing I because I get this all the time, people like target man like how are you out there, finding these apartment buildings you film to TV shows you have two kids you.

Scott Hawksworth: Right yeah how are you doing it.

Tarek El Moussa: Very well.

Here here’s my trick, are you ready.

Scott Hawksworth: i’m ready.

Tarek El Moussa: leverage so here’s what I learned when I first started flipping houses, I was a machine man, I was working 12 to 16 hours a day, seven days a week, and I had no other choice.

And I had no money, but I was incredible at finding deals so earlier on, I found out it’s like hey if I can find deals people want to give me money.

So that’s how I built my flipping business i’d find the deals the investors would come so now, I take that history and what have I done today today, I have a global brand i’m known.

You know around the world i’m billions of people because of my TV shows, and the things i’ve done.

And and here’s what I found in the apartment or in general in the commercial space, there are so many incredible operators out there that are finding amazing deals all over the country.

But a lot of them can’t buy all these buildings and they just don’t have the capital, so now i’ve flip flop, the equation.

Where I used to bring the deal, and now I bring the capital, so what I do is, I take the celebrity brand that i’ve built.

I network and reach out to the top operators in each class around the country interview them work with them, and once we identify the operators that we think man these guys are the best.

Those are the ones we’re partnering with so when someone invests with T m capital they’re also investing with me my operating partner, the specialist who source these deals.

Scott Hawksworth: Right, I mean I think that’s that’s incredible how you’ve sort of taken that strategy and and now leverage, you know here’s my brand here’s my REACH, how can we, how can we apply this to multifamily.

Tarek El Moussa: yeah because I mean if i’m out there by myself there’s there’s only so many opportunities, I can find.

There are so many deals, I can find, but now, if I take my brand and I make connections with operators all around the country.

The opportunities keep on coming in So for me I you everything I do is around leverage I leverage my name leverage my experience and in the end it gives us more opportunity.

Scott Hawksworth: Right, and you know you mentioned that you say no to a lot of deals, can you kind of speak to maybe, what are the considerations when you’re looking across deals that make you think you know what this isn’t for us this isn’t something that’s going to really work with our strategy.

Tarek El Moussa: yeah he does it’s just a picky by box, you know, last couple years everything’s just been so crazy in the multifamily space where you know we’re writing offers on building people are coming in 1020 30% higher.

And quite honest i’m not looking to play that game, I was in real estate in 2007 and eight.

Scott Hawksworth: You seen what can happen.

Tarek El Moussa: You don’t for me, I honestly like right now interesting climate, I want to sleep at night, so I have to wait longer to find better deals, I have no problem sitting on the sidelines, because when those day will come when those deals come that’s when we strike.

Scott Hawksworth: yeah awesome absolutely speaking to maybe some of the opportunities you’ve had and the flips that you’ve been a part of what was maybe one of your most challenging but ultimately successful flips if you could share a story there.

Tarek El Moussa: Man that’s a good question so there’s the one the one that really stands out to me, it was a valuable lesson, it was on the last season of flip or flop, I don’t know if you saw it, it was a beautiful ocean view house in San Clemente California sold it for.

Over $2 million, I think.

was like happening profit, it was a great project, but this House had major foundation problems and.

I hired a foundation company they came out, we got the bid, it was like $80,000 or $100,000 whatever it was.

And I said okay go to work, so you know time goes by, we get the permits and they go do their work, and then you know we can notify that the House is complete, so I go back to the House to film at it.

And the entire House is crooked and like bed, like the whole House, so what this what this company did is they secured the Foundation, they just never have leveled the.

Scott Hawksworth: foundation right they did one too.

Tarek El Moussa: So for me, it was a lesson i’m like well if you’re doing foundation repairs, I mean wouldn’t that mean you’re going to make it back to a house, what do you think that.

Scott Hawksworth: Right.

Tarek El Moussa: not always so then it was a big fight with them, but in the end it worked out, we had to do a lot more foundation work, we had to do a lot of framing work, we had a rip off the exterior stucco.

Huge nightmare of a project, but in the end, the most beautiful house we’ve ever done the coolest views, one of the highest sales prices and one of the bigger problems.

Scott Hawksworth: Absolutely, we were talking a lot about you know you’re you’re looking at deals from all over the country perhaps what are some markets when you look at multifamily currently that you really like and what do you like about those markets.

Tarek El Moussa: yeah you know honestly like I love like you know the sundial obviously you know we’ve bought a few buildings in Texas, and in Arizona, but you know really any.

Any fast paced fast growing metropolitan area is kind of what we’re going after and.

And that’s why we partner with so many operators is so we can see so many opportunities and that’s The important thing with real estate, you know, the more deals, you have to look at the better opportunities you’re going to find.

Scott Hawksworth: Right right and from a single family perspective, I mean how how key was it for you, I mean so many.

On flip or flop so many of the opportunities there were focused in California, is that a market that you just feel you still know the best and.

And you’re most confident with, or is it one of those things where you’re constantly looking at other markets, whether it would be single family or multifamily.

Tarek El Moussa: yeah so I mean flipping heavy and obviously southern California, but I do buy Rentals out of state, I think I have about 80 houses and Oklahoma rental properties, I think we have 30 or 40 in California, but overall rental properties 200 and those are all self funded so.

Like like I said i’ve been flipping houses to make active income.

So I can take that money and go buy passive real estate investments.

Scott Hawksworth: Right right and and for you it’s it’s not necessarily you know when you look at a market it’s it’s is it more about the opportunity within that if you’re looking for like a value add.

Tarek El Moussa: 100% I mean you give me any market around the country, and you show me an apartment building that you can get a 30 40% discount on i’m pretty sure all of us want to buy it.

Scott Hawksworth: Absolutely so so I guess to that point, because I know you know I speak to investors, the end developers as well and sponsors.

And sometimes they say you know what we don’t even touch certain markets if this market is you know not landlord friendly, so to speak, or something like that we don’t even touch it that’s not really your your kind of approach or like well what where’s the value and if there’s.

Well i’ll go for it.

Tarek El Moussa: When I say don’t touch it that’s not our focus and our operators aren’t in those markets and example is California i’m not looking to buy multifamily in California right now there’s a lot going on.

That being said, if there was 100 unit building worth $50 million that someone wanted to sell me for 25 would I buy it heck yeah I work.

Scott Hawksworth: Right you’d be crazy to say no right.

Tarek El Moussa: Exactly so that’s not the focus, but we wouldn’t we would never pass out opportunity.

Scott Hawksworth: Absolutely, when you look at multifamily you know there’s a lot going on right now, and a lot that has been going on what are, maybe some current trends that you’ve seen in multifamily and maybe also single family that are really compelling to you and that you’re kind of following.

Tarek El Moussa: yeah I mean I like the biggest trends what I said earlier, is really starting to create a good environment and a happy place for the tenants, you know the turnover is expensive, as you know, and.

it’s all about creating that Community feel and making people feel like they have a home and.

and making them want to stay in that home.

Scott Hawksworth: Right right absolutely Okay, can you share a bit you know you’ve you’ve kind of started from this point of where you were you were a real estate agent, and then you.

You know you had all the success with TV show flipping houses now you’re going out and you have this fund and investors are coming to you and they’re saying hey Tara you know.

Help help me generate more wealth, I want to invest in you here’s my capital, can you tell me a bit about your capital base, you know that the types of investors that you’re working with, and what are their goals.

Tarek El Moussa: You know, right now, we’re working with accredited investors in the future, because the brand is more appealing to the massive we have a lot of lot of eyes on us.

We would like to get into the accredited space, eventually, but right now it’s only credit investors so typically the people we’re dealing with they do have some real estate experience or knowledge and a lot of them have done some passive real estate investing.

So you know really it’s just.

You know it’s the fans the followers that have watched me over the last 1012 years on TV that that see me do business on TV and they want to partner with me and and obviously people don’t just partner with me because it’s me, I mean they’ll call me because it’s me.

But that’s right great the deal has to be a good deal and that’s why the primary focus is making sure we acquire fantastic assets.

Scott Hawksworth: Absolutely kind of speaking of you know multifamily I always kind of have my little stump speech, where historically multifamily has been one of the most resilient.

Real Estate classes out there and that’s through even you know 2008 and beyond, and there’s a lot of economic uncertainty right now and you’ve you’ve lived through what happened in 2008.

i’m curious what’s the impact you’re seeing when we’re talking about you know inflation rising interest rates what’s the impact you’re seeing on both multifamily and single family and your overall strategy.

Tarek El Moussa: Great question it all comes down to the affordability index, and when you talk about the SF our space, you know the rates go from two and a half or 2.75 to 6% is that can affect people’s purchasing power.

yeah absolutely.

A little bit so that’s one thing you know but.

At the same time, you know it’s.

it’s really based on what the government wants to do with the economy, I mean in the last week I think they dropped the interest rate almost one whole percentage points after freaking out the whole world raising a three percentage points right so.

it’s so hard to predict what’s going to happen with real estate, I remember when the pandemic hit I said, this is it financial crisis is coming I start unloading properties get them off the books get.

them off the books 90 days later they’re going up 10% a week.

So you know it’s in that’s why it’s so hard to predict the future in this business but but for me.

Take it one day at a time, make sure you buy right, one thing I don’t do is buy based on this unrealistic future appreciation over the next five years right like that’s not that’s not something I like to do.

It has to be a deal today it doesn’t have to turn into a deal, but it has to be a deal today.

Scott Hawksworth: So yeah I mean I think that’s a good point because there’s also been especially in multifamily we’ve seen rental rates just increasing across the board.

You know, it seems like it doesn’t matter what market it’s more just a speed of of increase there and what you’re saying is is that when you are looking at.

At an asset at a property you’re not you’re not going to assume that’s always going to be gangbusters you’re looking at that at that asset at that time at that deal at that time.

Tarek El Moussa: yeah absolutely and I learned this valuable lesson, the first rental property i’m going to tell you a great story, the first rental property I ever bought was in Charlotte North Carolina.

2006 I think I was like 25 years old and I man I bought a four bedroom two bathroom brand new construction 2200 square foot house for $160,000.

In 2006 entry level homes in California that were falling over were selling for 600,000 so I was like there is no way I can lose money on this House, it was 160 grand.

So, by the end of 2007 that house was worth about 80 so it dropped by 50% I had to rent it out at 1200 a month the rent dropped to 950 a month.

And I remember being so stressed out, not knowing what to do, should I for clothes, should I short sale, should I write this thing out and in 2006 I had lost I had to sell you know a lot of stuff because of that, you know the real estate market but I never lost anything.

I sold assets.

But but yeah so here here’s The interesting thing about that house, so this is what 12 1213 years later.

That house that I paid 164 that went to at.

today’s worth 370 5000 i’m going to say that again the House I paid 164 that went down to 18 now worth 375 the House that I rented out 1200 that dropped to 950 just got rewrite it at.

$2,100 a month, so what’s The lesson there.

hold.

Real Estate hold real estate and is probably the most valuable real estate lessons i’ve ever learned.

Scott Hawksworth: So I guess that’s I think that’s a great lesson and there’s a lot of folks that, especially when we talk multifamily there’s this focus on the exit right.

You know okay well we’ll stabilize and then, when can we access, especially for investors.

You know they’ll they’ll say okay that’s what i’m going to get a lot of my return that’s what they’re really excited about.

Is that is is the exit a big part of your strategy or or do you when when you guys are looking at you know, a multi family asset.

Are you open to hey if this if this assets, a buy and hold for forever then that’s what it’ll be we’re not necessarily driving towards one strategy or the other.

Tarek El Moussa: yeah you know so i’ll give you an example, so depends on the operator we’re working with, but on the on the apartments there are exit strategies.

But there’s actually a webinar tomorrow night for tm capital all the Informations on my instagram page.

And we’re going into a self storage development and surprise Arizona, and the idea there isn’t to build it an exit the idea is to build it refinancing it get the money back keep it and almost treated like an annuity.

And we want to do multiple multiple just like that, just to create that passive income to create that cash flow.

So for the for investors, you know there’s different options as buying long long term hold which I love or there’s you know by go in fixed it have raised the values and then exit and cash out and do it again.

I mean across the board with my company, we have different options and.

And yeah so that’s pretty much it.

Scott Hawksworth: yeah really kind of a blended strategy there and then do you find with investors it’s kind of it’s kind of it attracts all kinds of investors with different goals.

Tarek El Moussa: yeah because you know investors, they all want different things one my love houses one month love apartments.

One my like flipping apartments one fight like you know the passive income so and that’s why it’s important to create opportunity right so once the.

Once we get our investors and we interview them we talk with them, we figure out what their goals are, and then we really, really try hard to make sure we get them an asset that makes them happy.

Scott Hawksworth: absolutely want to ask you about partnerships because it’s it’s so big in in the multifamily world when we’re talking about owners operators when.

You know i’ve seen on your on flip or flop you’ve had folks that you partner with on deals sometimes things worked out, sometimes they didn’t.

How do you generally approach, a partnership in terms of you know, finding the right fit is it just a matter of having those conversations, what do you look for in a partnership.

Tarek El Moussa: You know it’s really about having to two different groups or two different people bring bringing equal value to the table.

and on top of bringing equal value they I think it’s important to get along to and have a similar mindset and similar thoughts on business.

Because, at the end of the day, you know if you’re doing business with someone you, you want to make sure you have a good relationship so one you have to bring something to the table and to I think it’s important to live each other.

Scott Hawksworth: yeah absolutely um you’ve had a lot of active roles in real estate, you know you flipped houses and you could say you know okay.

You know we’re going to do this we’re going to approach it this way we’re going to have this strategy, when you hire a passive investor.

You know, one of the things with lps is they say you know, can have conversations, but they don’t have necessarily control i’m curious how, how is that different for you, or do you like that aspect when you’re sort of a passive investor versus not as it is it more.

Tarek El Moussa: comforting.

Scott Hawksworth: To you, is it.

Tarek El Moussa: i’m just gonna say if I wasn’t a real estate and I was an LP and one of my deals I wouldn’t want control because i’m not the professional.

Right so there’s an entire professional team with decades of experience running these projects So for me, those are the people that should be running those projects.

Scott Hawksworth: Right and so, then I guess that goes back to selecting the team right and I guess, could you speak a bit about the the tm capital team that you have and sort of how you assembled that team and and and where their strengths are.

Tarek El Moussa: yeah absolutely like like I said i’m more excited about tm capital than that pretty much anything i’ve ever done and in building the team was very important and.

You know, one of the unique things I did, which I always think outside the box and I told myself as I needed to bring in the absolute best partners possible on this project.

So what did I do I, this is a funny story, I went on forbes rented article I got connected with the number one executive recruiter in the country spoke with their CEO I told him I needed to build an awesome team for this company and they helped me build a team.

Scott Hawksworth: I love it so it was like read Article find a great recruiter and get me people and then put it together right.

Tarek El Moussa: that’s it, I mean, so I mean here’s here’s where I was asked, like who do you think is better at finding partners me or the specialist that find them on a daily basis, well, I would say the.

words that find them on a daily basis and that’s just how I live my life, I always try to think creative I try to think outside the box so.

For me it worked obviously there was a cost to it, but at the end it was worth it, because now, I have a rock star team that’s it’s just we’re just so excited about everything we’re working on.

Scott Hawksworth: Right, and I think that goes back to maybe an overall business philosophy and it can apply, of course, to real estate is know what you’re good at know what you know and then find the folks that are great at something else and have skills that compliment yours and then lean on them right.

Tarek El Moussa: hundred percent hundred percent just like lps lean on GPS right like it’s all this business is about helping each other.

Scott Hawksworth: And then you know we always say that you know when we have our pitch days or what have you and.

I always say hey what’s the team like what’s their track record what have they done, and if you as an LP can feel comfortable with the team and the track record.

Well then, you’re gonna you’re gonna sleep, a lot more soundly with your investment you’re going to say you know what topics Turks teams, has it under control, I can I can snuggle up soundly and know that whatever comes at them, whatever challenges.

Tarek El Moussa: they’re going to navigate it right yeah and one thing that’s important for the lps to know is every deal that.

tm capitals involved with I also personally invest in these deals, so I put my money where my mouth is.

Scott Hawksworth: I mean that’s huge that’s huge that that aligns interests and that’s another important thing when you’re talking about a deal and and if the interests are aligned that’s good for the LP.

Tarek El Moussa: yeah I mean let’s just be honest buying real estate is easy, I mean.

Should I be we can go, we can all go by apartment.

buildings, but what an escrow every single day, you know buying good real estate.

that’s not easy and that’s why it takes time.

Scott Hawksworth: mm hmm absolutely tarik I want to thank you so much for joining me on the show today, offering so many insights about your experiences and the great things going on at tm capital and well a couple questions one do you ever see maybe a multi family show in your future on hgtv.

Tarek El Moussa: i’m actually trying to figure out how to make that happen right now.

How to create a captivating show around business design apartments that would fit on the hgtv discovery platform So hopefully that’s coming in the future.

Scott Hawksworth: Okay well we’ll keep an eye out for that and for now if folks want to find out a bit more connect with T m capital see what opportunities, you have maybe the webinar but anything else you have going on, where can they do that, where, should they go.

Tarek El Moussa: Absolutely, so our website is T m capital dot CEO our instagram page is just tm capital and like I said i’m not sure when this is going out but.

Tomorrow at 5pm we have a webinar reviewing the self storage units that we’re going to be developing in surprise Arizona, so I think a lot of people are going to be excited about that one.

Scott Hawksworth: Fantastic and we actually had a recent episode, we did on self storage, and so I think it’s one of those asset classes, that is so complimentary to multifamily.

And so I think that’s that’s really I like hearing that you’re doing that because I think that is a fantastic strategy tarik Thank you so so much.

Tarek El Moussa: All right, thank you.